tv Anderson Cooper 360 CNN July 3, 2013 10:00pm-11:01pm PDT
that's all for us tonight. wishing you a happy independence day. obviously we brits do not celebrate the 4th of july with the same enthusiasm but i wish you a good time any way. the coverage of the george zimmerman trial starts now. prosecution gets ready to call the final witness. the defense prepares to call theirs. welcome to this special report self defense or murder the george zimmerman trial. the trial is headed to the final stretch. the prosecution calling what could be the next to last witness today. the dna expert.
and the mother is expected to take the stand on friday before the prosecution rests. another big day in a trial that's had nothing but big days so far. martin savidge is in the courtroom and starts us off. >> though a symbol to many, the hood sweat shart that trayvon martin wore the night he was killed is a key piece of evidence. the state expert said he found no trace of george zimmerman's dna on the sweatshirt. not even on the sleeves or cuffs, nearest to the fit fists that the defendant says martin was hitting him with and no dna under his fingernails and what about martin's dna? was it found on the gun which by one zimmerman account the teen actually reached for and touch. >> swab you developed from the pistol grip of the defendant's gun was positive for blood, correct? >> yes. >> there was a mixture. the major matched the defendant george zimmerman and you were able to exclude trayvon martin
as having dna on the pistol grip, is that correct? >> yes, trayvon martin was excluded as being a possible contributor to the mixture on the grip. >> the hoodie was tested by a firearms expert said the hoodie was touching it. >> what did you find when you conducted the test with the sweatshirt. >> it was consistent with rez deuce and physical effect of a contact shot. >> again, evidence saying the end of the gun was against the material when it was fired. >> yes. >> the prosecution also pointed out the night he killed martin, zimmerman carried a fully loaded weapon with an additional round in the chamber ready to fire and the prosecution got the witness to admit it is not out of the ordinary. >> you did not consider that an unusual occurrence. >> no. >> the state was out to show that zimmerman was wanting to be
a cop and studying criminal justice at a local college. on the stand a former professor described zimmerman as one of his best students and said he gave him an "a." the professor said the topic was a frequent discussion in the class. >> i wanted to teach the class from a practical standpoint where they can take something from it and apply it to their own lives. with florida and other states they have what is called the stand your ground law, which evolved from the castle doctrine in case law. >> did you cover that specifically? >> yes. >> did you discuss specifically self defense and stand your ground laws in connection of violent crimes such as murder? >> yes. >> it was the testimony of another professor that provide one of the trial's few lighter moments. unable to testify in person, gordon pleasants appeared in
court via skype. >> i can't hear. >> first there were sound problems but then the digital demons. >> this is someone calling. >> as prison sant's face and name were carried on national tv people began to call and disrupt the testimony. a frustrated judge ordered the video call stopped. with the defense finally catching on to what was happening. >> there's now a really good chance we are being toyed with. >> in court, the judge announced the state had bn planned an arrest and now that won't happen and won't happen until friday after the 4th of july hole day. martin savidge, cnn, sanford, florida. >> forensic scientist from the john j. college and legal analyst and sunny hostin.
and killer ambition. on the defense side, an inside look at how the criminal justice system works and sometimes doesn't. i want to start with you. the firearms expert testified the gun was touching trayvon martin's sweatshirt when george zimmerman fired. that's not what the autopsy showed. >> that's right. i find it mysterious. she did all of the right things. she test fired with the garments and concluded it was a contact shot. there were two garments the hoodie sweatshirt and underlying sweatshirt and the body. she's looking at gunshot residue, burned and unburned particles and the tearing and singeing of the fibers around the hull. the conclusion is clear and makes sense to me it was a contact shot. what is mysterious is the
autopsy report indicates not that it was a close shot or a contact shot but it was an intermediate distance shot which tells me it was probably between six and 18 inches. >> so who's likely to be more accurate? >> i would tend to think the ballistics expert is more accurate. the bullet had to penetrate both garments before it hit the body. you wouldn't necessarily see the stiping, which is the burning and bragss in the skin around the hole, the bullet hole. therefore, if you see those stipling marks, sometimes called tattooing you can conclude the distance. >> does it really matter? >> honestly it doesn't. both will indicate a close-in shot, a struggle. >> that's no surprise. >> no surprise. it supports george zimmerman's story. >> the prosecution had the dna testifies testify about the dna found on the gun. i want to play that for the viewers. >> the swab with the dna you
developed from the pistol grip of the defendant's gun is positive for blood, correct? >> yes. >> and then there was a mixture. the major matched the defendant george zimmerman. >> yes. >> and you were able to exclude trayvon martin as having dna on the pistol grip, is that correct? >> yes. trayvon martin was excluded as being a possible contributor to this mixture on the grip. >> yesterday zimmerman's best friend testified that zimmerman said that trayvon grabbed for the gun. is this an inconsistency at all? >> i think it is significant for a couple of reasons. one, i was in the courtroom, anderson and i cannot begin to tell you how in to this witness the jury was. they were leaning forward, taking notes and even laughed with him. he was engaging with pretty dull dna information. they loved him. i think it is the result of the csi effect. people like dna. they feel it is definitive
evidence. because of that, i think it may not show us what happened that night, but certainly it may tell the jury what zimmerman said what happened couldn't have happened. trayvon martin couldn't have touched the gun because his dna was not on the holster or the gun as george zimmerman described it. i think given that my observations in the courtroom, i think it is important to the jury. >> just because it wasn't on the gun doesn't mean it wasn't there originally and got washed away in the rain. >> the testing they do for dna in this laboratory is not high sensitivity testing. it is the ordinary dna testing. if you have 15, 14, 13 cells, you wouldn't ever see it. in other words the limits of detection make it such you can not pick up small amounts of dna. also, the rain could have washed away dna. i'm not surprised by any of the findings by this expert.
>> the dna expert talked about swabs under trayvon martin's fingernails. i want to play that testimony. >> from the testing you did not find his dna there. >> no. there was nothing from trayvon martin. >> if we could move to the second part which is i believe fingernail scrapings from the left hand. tell your findings as to that, sir. >> yes, the left hand stick was not tested for the possible presence of blood. didn't have any staining whatsoever. i swabbed that in the testing and did not get any dna results from that swab. >> why was that important for the prosecution? >> it is important -- i can't say it is critical. what it proves is that george zimmerman, if people understand george zimmerman to be saying trayvon martin grabbed him by the head in a manner that would cause some kind of dna from george zimmerman to get under
his fingernails and slammed his head, as he claimed, in to the sidewalk. you might expect some amount of dna from george zimmerman to be under his fingernails but also might not. i have to say it is helpful to the prosecution. it is not a slam dunk or a big ticket item but it is something to add to the evidence that the prosecution has presented to show the contact between trayvon martin and george zimmerman may not be as zimmerman described. >> mark gary goes, do you think some of the testimony was a wash because the defense was able to get the dna expert to say he couldn't find dna didn't mean there wasn't trayvon martin's dna on the holster of the gun. >> i think it is a wash. i can't tell you, lawrence will tell you, how many times you will see, and especially with guns and depending on what the surface is of it. it is very difficult, even when you know somebody has handled that gun to pick up dna off of
it, fingerprints off of it, or any telltale signs. you would be surprised at how often these tests come back negative. i don't think it is of any great shakes one way or another. >> mark, the prosecution established that zimmerman's gun wasn't made with an external safety button and loaded with a bullet in the chamber ready to fire. the defense tried to counter this. let's long at that. >> you stated in person plrks zimmerman since we know it to be his gun, right? >> yes. >> would have wrapped it to make sure it was ready to fire and put another bullet in the magazine and reloaded it. correct? >> yes. >> is that the usual occurrence in your experience dealing with firearms? >> i typically see a wide variety of weapons. >> sorry, i interrupted you. >> that's okay. >> you did not consider that unusual occurrence, did you? >> no.
>> as a matter of fact, probably law enforcement officer had a chance to see that it is normal that there is one in the chamber in a full magazine, correct? >> yes. >> military do that, correct? >> i'm not sure. >> so mark, if the prosecution was trying to paint george zimmerman as trigger happy wa wannabe cop, do you think they did a good job at that. >> yeah. the way they portrayed george zimmerman he has a depraved mind and evil motive. this shows it is one way of many that he would have the gun and not out of the ordinary and much to do about nothing. i think it was a good job of neutralizing. it always goes to the side of the defense because it is the state's burden. when you level something out
that hurts the state. >> was there anything else important? >> there were no bombshells. none at all. i tell you, anderson, i have a care riff license and i don't carry my gun because i think it is too dangerous, but the fact the gun is fully loaded, again, is not a surprise. if you are going to carry a gun you have to be prepared to fire it. i think the safest way to handle a gun is don't carry it. i think law enforcement will keep a fully-loaded guchbl i'm not shocked by anything here. no bombshells here. >> lawrence, appreciate it. everyone stay with us. plenty more to talk about including laughter from george zimmerman. we haven't seen that before. we will talk about what led to it and what the jury may think. special coverage continues when we come back. la's known definitely for its traffic,
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reasonably feared for his life or serious injury and establishing he wrongfully saw trayvon martin as another one of those in his words "f'ing" punks today they called a military lawyer who taught a course that stayed florida stand your ground law was a topic in the class. something the defense tried to change the focus to the fear that they say zimmerman felt that night. >> on the issue of injuries when you talk about that with the class and your understanding of the law is that the focus is what is going on in the person's mind, not whether they have actually been injured. it's the fear of the injury, is it not? >> it is imminent injury, or
imminent fear. so the fact alone that there isn't an injury doesn't necessarily mean that the person did not have a reasonable apprehension of fear. the fact there were injuries have a tendency to show, to support the person had a reason of a henge of fear but the fact there wasn't an injury doesn't necessarily mean there was an apprehension of fear. >> you don't have to wait until you are almost dead before you can defend yourself? >> no, i would advise you don't do that. >> back with the panel. mark, this is what we were talking about yesterday when you were arguing over the extent of his injuries. as long as george zimmerman was scared by the extent of his injuries, whether or not those injuries were something that were as serious as he thought
they were, that doesn't matter. what matters is what he felt about them, correct? >> that's why i don't understand this witness either. if you are the prosecution, why do you put this witness on? he in that little exchange gave precisely what we discussed last night is going to be the defense's argument. my guess, you will see the jury talk about this precisely this when they go back first thing in their deliberations. this is one of the key issues for them to urnderstand that an their own witness cuts them off at the knees. >> marcia clark, do you agree with that. >> a little bit. i understand why they put him on. they wanted to show that george zimmerman knew the kind of story to tell. to show he understood the law and what he would have to say. the professor is correct. the actual extent of the injuries is not definitive answers as to whether or not the
person reasonably believed he was imminent endangered of death. and the nature of the injuries conflicts with george zimmerman's account. that's what is significant about the injuries, not whether they were death defying. that is a red herring. the issue is whether george jrch was truthful when he said he bashed my head in the pavement and smacked me and rained blows -- that kind of thing. whether that is true or he was exaggerating it. >> couldn't they have accomplished the same thing by introducing the syllabus itself? why did they bring this guy in and allow the defense to get what i consider to be defense-oriented testimony out? >> i know, mark. i can't answer. >> i just don't -- >> i have -- >> i actually thought it was helpful to the prosecution. we have to remember the jury saw the interview he gave to sean hannity. when he asked him what about
stand your ground law, did you know about it. he said i found out about after the shooting this witness contradicted that. he said he thought it and taught it practically and said that george zimmerman was of his best students and he gave him an a in the class. >> why didn't he introduce the report card and syllabus. >> let me play the interview the jurors saw for our viewers. >> a lot of the case has to do with stand your ground. you have heard a lot about it. i'm curious prior to this night, this incident, had you even heard of stand your ground? >> i wanted to teach the class from a practical standpoint where students could relate and take something from it and apply to their own lives. you know with florida and other states they have what happen is called the stand your ground
law, which evolved from the castle doctrine case law. >> did you cover that specifically? >> yes. >> did you discuss specifically self defense and stand your ground laws in connection of violent crimes such as murder? >> yes. >> so, mark, to zurn sunny's point that would seem to indicate he is incorrect or not telling the truth during the hannity interview. >> or not paying attention this class. >> he is an "a" student. he got an with "a." >> he wouldn't be the first "a" student that got it without studying. >> he got an "a." >> the state's whole case is going to be to attack the credibility of george zimmerman. they have opined he's not taken the stand. they are trying to get in every statement and show every
discrepancy and contradiction they can. lay one atop the other. that's their argument. they have no other argument other than george zimmerman has been lying and he created this and over reacted. they have to prove over reaction to get lesser included manslaughter and that's why you are hearing of a deprafed mind. knowing they have hardly any chance on a second degree merchandise homicide. they are going to take every statement and show every discrepancy they can and that's the plan. >> the defense was fighting allowing the witness. zimmerman's criminal justice professor to testify because they say brought in his past. mark o'mara said on this program yesterday that if this evidence was allowed in, which it was, it could open up evidence from trayvon martin's past in to the courtroom. i want top play what mark o'mara said to me yesterday. >> based on what was in george's
background, his past through the table that it brings in what trayvon martin brings to the table all of his violent acts that we know about and some of the fighting he was involved in. if that is not on the table, whatever george did in the background shouldn't be on the table, as well. >> what part of trayvon martin's past could come in as evidence? >> this is the variation of the goosy gander rule. if you are going to let in something for zimmerman, you should let in something for martin. obviously, the only way i can see -- and maybe you can correct me under florida law. only way i see them get in the trayvon martin stuff is if zimmerman testifies and pushes the story a little farther. i don't think based on the current take that they have introduced to this jury they are -- that this judge will let that go down. >> do you agree with that. >> yeah. mark is right. they didn't open the door.
the judge was very astute the way she ruled. she said this is the theory of prosecution. they were attempting to establish -- also it is valid in my opinion as far as cross-examination and impeachment. they came the from another angle and didn't open the door to character. they had a theory of prosecution. they use it under that and did did not open the doompl i agree if zimmerman takes the stand and opens it in another area it will be a back and forth. not going to happen, not with this judge and the defense thinking about putting him on the stand. >> he's never going to take the stand. >> marcia and sunny you agree. >> no way. >> oh, god. yes. no rchblt absolutely no reason. i can't see him doing any better on the witness stand than statements already introduced no reason for it. >> a reminder, for more on the story go to cnn.com. ahead, trayvon martin's mom is expected to be one of the final
witnesses on friday. many believe it could be emotional testimony. i will talk to the attorney for the martin family. more from our panel ahead. a he. it grabbed the patient's record before we even picked him up. it found out the doctor we needed was at st. anne's. wiggle your toes. [ driver ] and it got his okay on treatment from miles away. it even pulled strings with the stoplights. my ambulance talks with smoke alarms and pilots and stadiums. but, of course, it's a good listener too. [ female announcer ] today cisco is connecting the internet of everything. so everything works like never before. [ female announcer ] today cisco is connecting the internet of everything. we're talking juwith lisa here. about the walmart low price guarantee. that's your receipt from another store? yup! let's put it to the test. ok. nothing says all american like... bbq sauce! yes! you know if you find a lower advertised price they'll match it at the register. nice! brats for? we're grilling out! you'll love this walmart's always working to lower costs so you get more savings. oh my goodness! ok you ready? i'm ready... whooa. that's incredible! that's the walmart low price guarantee backed by ad match.
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trayvon martin's mother is expected to take the stand on friday. the judge is yet to rule whether they will be able to bring up anything from george zimmerman's past. thank you for being on the show. earlier today there were thoughts the prosecution would call trayvon martin's mother to testify. do you expect she will take the stand when the court resumes on friday? >> there is a strong possibility
she will take the stand. >> what about trayvon martin's brother? there's some who expect maybe he would be asked to testify, as well. >> there's a strong possibility he will testify. >> how important to the prosecution's case do you think their testimony is in terms of identifying whose voice is on the 911 call? >> they call them to the stand, i would assume that it is very important to their case. however, i'm not the lawyer trying the case. i have to defer to whatever their strategy is. if they call him, i expect they expect to get strong testimony from them in the case. >> the state presented evidence about george zimmerman's past, his education course work. i heard that that could open the door for more discussion on trayvon martin's history. do you think that should be admissible that one opens the door to another. >> not at all. i think we have to remember in
this case we know clearly that trayvon martin was trying to get away from george zimmerman. when he approached george zimmerman he asked why are you following me? and so trayvon's past had nothing to do with that interaction, which was the initial interaction. we really note that from what happened in the case that george zimmerman was following trayvon and almost three different times came close to him and had opportunity to say who he was and failed to do so. as you heard from detectives quite possibly had he done that this situation would have never happened. we think his background and also you have to think his interaction with detectives where mark o'mara has come forth with the theory that george zimmerman was participating with the officers, acting in good faith. things he has done to bolster george zimmerman's testimony goes in to the knowledge that he had and his experience in dealing with these type of self defense situations and knowing
if he showed the appearance of cooperating with law enforcement that would go to his benefit. he learned these things at his college he attended. >> how concerned are you about the prosecution's case at this point? they are basically one day away from resting their case. there are a lot of analysts, former prosecutors, defense attorneys, who are looking at this case and theying they don't see the state has done a successful job of proving second-degree murder. perhaps the jury will come back with a manslaughter charge. are you confident in the way the prosecution's case has unfolded in the testimony given bay lot of the prosecution of witnesses, which a lot of analysts say has worked to the benefit of the defense. >> i have to tell you, anderson, i'm sitting in the courtroom every day. unlike other analysts who do not have an opportunity to witness the jury and see the evidence and to see the interaction, to see the jurors and how they are responding to the evidence, i
don't think they get the full body of it. >> you think you are seeing something the tv isn't showing. >> right. they can't see the jurors. i can see the jurors. i see for, for example, when the expert was showing the contact with the gun i saw every one of them was engaged in writing. it was powerful. someone sitting in l.a. he would never get that. but i saw it. >> were you surprised by the testimony -- for instance the lead investigator on the case because a number of people observing and watching on television said they never heard a police officer called by the prosecution give testimony so favorable to a defense. >> well, i think also we have to remember how this case unfolded in terms of the investigation interacting with the police department, the case taken over by the florida department of law enforcement, somewhat involving the fbi.
no one likes for someone to come in and take over their case. at the end of the day, you have to remember one thing that came out of the testimony is he thought that george zimmerman was exaggerating his injuries. so you have to take it. it is an up and down thing. >> you think there maybe ill will on the part of the lead investigator to the way he was taken off the case, to the way the case was handled? >> i wouldn't say there is ill will. i think because he had mixed emotions. at the end of the day he wanted to be to be charged at least with mchblz i would rest my opinion on that. >> daryl parks, appreciate you being with us tonight. >> thank you. >> back to our panel. marcia, it's a difficult position to be interviewing the attorney for the family. only so much i guess he would say. i'm not sure how much he really wants to be forthcoming. he did seem to indicate that
there maybe -- or he perceives perhaps dissatisfaction on the part of the lead investigator as to the way the case was handled. >> he did hint at that. he didn't want to come right out and say it and i'm not sure what the truth of that is. the jury is not going to know, i'm sure. i think he made important points. number one that he felt, even at the time, that george zimmerman exaggerated trayvon martin's aggression conduct and his injuries and he also made it clear he would not have stopped and stopped trayvon martin or thought anything suspicious in his behavior as described by zimmerman. he made strong points for the prosecution. he made other points that the defense has been able to parlay. one more thing that he said that i thought was extremely important to remember. he said, you know, we can't see the jury's reaction to what is going on in court. and that is a very important point. we can't. sunny can and i think that is a good thing. >> yeah, sunny.
>> the problem is interpreting what they are doing. taking notes but what are they writing. but that is an important thing to remember and i remember feeling that way myself. you can't see what i can see. i see when they sit forward or sit back and that matters. >> sunny, you are in the courtroom and you see that, as well. >> absolutely. perhaps that's why my perspective has been different from everyone else. i'm in the courtroom every day and looking at the jury. i can feel what is going on in the courtroom. they have been engaged. a lot of times actually when the prosecution is asking questions they are looking at the prosecutor. when the defense attorneys are asking questions they are not really looking at the defense attorneys. a lot of times they are just looking at the witness. i feel that i have a different perspective because i'm in the jury room. the state has put on a compelling case to those jurors.
>> mark geragos, you are in l.a. >> i'm in berkeley today. >> do you think it is a valid point that the tv doesn't show the jurors and we are not in the room and the perception maybe different. >> i think your perception of what the jurors are doing is better if you are looking at the jurors. i absolutely disagree that you can read the jurors with any kind of specificity. i can't tell you how many times i thought somebody was with me that wasn't or against me and wasn't. we joke in the office it is like reading tea leaves to figure out what it means when a juror is writing or not writing or anything else. they can be totally engaged and totally against you. you know, i don't buy in to that. i think it is important to watch the testimony as it comes in, but anybody that claims they can figure out what the jurors are thinking the evidence comes in, they have better psychic powers
than i do. >> i think i do, mark. i think i do. >> i have been in the courtroom and what i observed is simply, you have one juror who takes notes for every single thing that comes out. you have one juror who outwardly appears disinterested and the other three or four that take notes at certain times intermittently. that to me is like geragos is saying, unless you are a master poker player, someone twitches their eyes do they have a good or bad thing. you don't know how to interpret it. this is an engaged jury. by and large, at least the five i have seen are really paying attention and seem to be following it. if that is true, then both sides will play to that. >> everyone stay where you are. george zimmerman's family stood firmly behind him in the case. maintaining he acted in self-defense and he's not a
racist. we will ask about the chances that any of them will be called to the witness stand. 2004. vietnam in 1972. [ all ] fort benning, georgia in 1999. [ male announcer ] usaa auto insurance is often handed down from generation to generation. because it offers a superior level of protection and because usaa's commitment to serve military members, veterans, and their families is without equal. begin your legacy, get an auto insurance quote. usaa. we know what it means to serve. cheryl burke is cha-cha-ing in depend silhouette briefs for charity, to prove that with soft fabric and waistband, the best protection looks, fits, and feels just like underwear. get a free sample and try for yourself.
strock possibility we will never know whose scream was heard. trayvon martin's mother says it is her son's voice saying any mother knows their child's call for help. >> were you able to identify whose voice it was screaming for help? >> yes, sir. >> who whose was it? >> it was absolutely georges. >> zimmerman's family maintained he acted in self defense and said he is not the man that
prosecutors made him out to be. randy king looks in it to. >> george zimmerman may have killed trayvon martin but make no mistake, his family says he's no monster. his older brother says that george zimmerman would never chase anyone down. >> he's the neighbor that everyone would want to have. he's the kind of guy that sees somebody struggling to change a tire and stops to help them or helps older people with their groceries. he goes out of his way to help people. he always has. >> reporter: at this bail hearing last year, george zimmerman's mother testified over the phone talked about him mentoring african-american students. >> he is protective of people and protective of homeless people and children. no matter their race. >> his father has tried to dispel rumors that george zimmerman is a racist who racially profiled trayvon martin the night he shot him. in a book he wrote about the case, he wrote "many of george's
closest most trusted friends are african-american" adding "there's a tremendous amount of evidence that george is absolutely not a racist in any sense of the word." in an effort to prove that zimmerman himself has african-american roots the family released this photo exclusively to a cnn legal analyst showing zimmerman's grandmother who is half black and his grandfather. the girl on the lap is george zimmerman's mother. but none of that squares with what his cousin said in police in the audio recording. >> i was afraid he may have done something because the kid was black. because growing up they have always made -- him and his family have always made statements that they don't like black people if they don't act like white people. >> his immediate family has always stayed on message. >> when this over, they hope people will conclude that george zimmerman is a nice guy.
his father likes to point out that he grew up in a close family with one brother and one sister raised in a religious catholic home. the priest thought so much of him he gave him his first job in the rectory. that's the george zimmerman his family wants the world to know. in terms of his son's injuries, the family described it by phone. >> the face was swollen. he had a protective cover over his nose. his lip was swollen and cut and there were two vertical gashes on the back of his head. >> he spoke to wofl in shadow early on. >> trayvon martin said something to the effect of you are going to die now or you are going to die tonight, something to that
effect. he continued to beat george. at some point george pulled his pistol. >> if any of the zimmerman's called to testify, a letter may provide what they would say on the witness stand. written on the anniversary of her son's arrest, her mother wrote april 11th, 2012 will be remembered by the zimmerman family as the day the justice system failed us as americans and as a consequence an innocent man was arrested for a crime he did not crime. solely to placate the masses. randi kaye, cnn, atlanta. >> joining us again our panel. the the prosecution may call trayvon martin's mom on friday before they rest their case. you think it is likely wise to call members of george zimmerman's family to talk about their claim that george
zimmerman's voice calling for help in the 911. >> i think they will absolutely do that. i can't understand why they wouldn't. i might even book end it. if they put her on friday and i know mark says they don't want to start until monday and may go to the four corners stall, the old dean smith stall. if they do that, then i would put him on monday. i don't think there is any down side to putting him on right after the prosecution rests with her. >> do you think having trayvon martin's mother and the father of george zimmerman, does that negate each other or because trayvon martin's parents have been in that courtroom every day and the jury has come to see them at times they have gotten up when the testimony is too emotional, too difficult or too graphic. do you think one is more powerful than the other? >> i do. i think that we have to remember there are six women on the jury.
we have to remember that five of them are mothers. they are going to relate to another mother telling them a mother knows her child's voice, especially in distress. it's something that as a mother myself i understand. i also want to say i wouldn't be surprised if they called trayvon martin's brother. he is well spoken and looks like trayvon martin. i think he would be a wonderful witness for the state. i wouldn't be surprised if he would be called. >> you think -- >> to identify his brother's voice. >> do you think that is why he would be called to identify his brother's voice. >> absolutely. when i interviewed him he talked about how close they were and they even shared a room. if anyone recalls his voice it would be his brother. if you have his brother and mother saying the same thing you
have the benefit of having the brother and mother who looks like trayvon martin who goes to college, looks like your frd guy. i think that will carry a lot of weight with the jury. >> more ahead. i want to get the panel's take on this what the prosecution needs to do and the breaking news in egypt. the country a powder keg as the u.s. embassy ordered nonessential personnel to evacuate. the situation is extremely fluid. an update ahead. what makes a sleep number store different?
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who do we see them calling, mark. >> my guess is it will be short. i think they would put on the father to testify to what you just played and have been playing. basically identifying his voice on the screen. i think they may put on their own pathologist. although i don't know why they would do that. and some other back fill. i don't think it would be a long defense case. i would imagine less than two days would be my guess. >> really? they don't need to put on a robust defense, you don't think? >> i don't think so. i think this is a case they have tried within the prosecution's case through cross-examination and basically turning the prosecution witnesses in to their own. i just don't think that mark will go there in terms of putting on a robust or lengthy defense. >> do you agree with that? >> that's exactly what will happen. they will close up a few holes.
they will address some of the inconsistencies. but the overall statements we have heard from zimmerman are pretty much correct. i think you will see a philly buster. they don't just happen in the legislature. they want to start the case on monday. they want to take the deposition of daryl parks before they proceed. i think you will see some things drag out tomorrow an go in to judgment or acquittal arguments and even though the judge wanted them end to today and start tomorrow, the great likelihood they will drag out today and judgment acquittal arguments and more than likely have them commence their case on monday. sunny, it is entirely possible for the jury, if they don't believe the state has proved second-degree murder the jury themselves could convict on manslaughter, correct? >> well, if they are charged, yeah. if they are instructed they can consider lesser included, like manslaughter i think that is very possible. >> marcia, is that likely they
will be instructed. >> oh, yeah. i can't imagine they wouldn't be. the defense may object. there are times when the defense wants to play an all or nothing game with the jury and say no, second degree, no manslaughter, second degree or nothing. it is a dicey, questionable move on their part and i don't think they will do it and even if they do the judge can overrule them and say i'm giving the instruction. there is substantial evidence to support it and give the lesser included instruction. i fully expect to see it here. >> thank you very much. let's get caught up on other stories we are following. susan hendrix is joining us. breaking news in egypt with the situation is fluid. hours after the military deposed the first democratically elected president. the muslim brotherhood say that mohamed morsi is under arrest. eight people were killed and 300 wounded in violent clashes today. pro and anti-morsi demonstrators filled the streets as you see
here. jouj outrage in south america over what happened to the jet carrying bolivia's president. there were suspicions that snowden was on board. the search revealed no sign of him. back home our look at the damage from the fire that took the lives of 19 elite hot shots. the fire is partially contained but officials are concerned it could flair up at anytime. a 360 follow, cnn obtained an exclusive video of american kenneth bay sentenced in april to 15 years hard labor in north korea. he appeals for authorities to forgive him and asks the u.s. government to secure his release. the justice department says tiffany's development vp is charged with stealing jewels totally $1.3 million in value
and selling them to an international jewelry company. back to you. >> thank you. that does it for our coverage of the george zimmerman trial. coming up another edition of ac 360 on the latest on the crisis in egypt. we'll be right back. probably the car. cause as you get older you start breaking down. i love my car. i want to take care of it. i have a bad wheel - i must say. my car is running quite well. keep your car healthy with the works. $29.95 or less after $10 mail-in rebate at your participating ford dealer. so you gotta take care of yourself? yes you do. you gotta take care of your baby? oh yeah!
vital testimony in the zimmerman trial about whose testimony was where and the prosecution gets ready to call it's final witnesses, including possibly zimmerman's mother but we begin with breaking news. the muslim brotherhood said mohamed morsy is being held under house arrest right now after being forced out by the military today after one year in office. tonight the country is a powder keg, the situation extremely fluid. the images extraordinary. pro and anti-morsy. a travel warning was issued for americans. egypt media said security forces arrested the political party